Beyond the Apocalypse: What The Four Horsemen Teach Us About Living in Today's World

The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse are often treated as distant, frightening symbols of the end times. But in this episode of Everyone Dies, we take a grounded, thoughtful look at what Conquest, War, Famine, and Death represent—and why they matter right now. From global conflict and food insecurity to health crises and the absolute certainty of mortality, these ancient images continue to mirror modern life.

This isn't a conversation about fear. By naming these struggles, we strip away their power, allowing us to live with greater intention, care deeply for one another, and remember that even in uncertain times, every single day is a gift. Get Show Notes Here: https://bit.ly/4ftH1ve

In This Episode:

• Comfort in the Darkness: A delicious recipe for Devils on Horseback and a beautiful reading from Anne Lamott on holding back the dark through radical self-love and practical gratitude.
• The Four Horsemen Unsealed: A deep dive into the historical, biblical, and artistic legacy of the riders from the Book of Revelation, and how their themes connect directly to our current societal struggles.
• The Weight of Choice: A striking reading from Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged on personal responsibility, absolutes, and the danger of compromising with evil.

Episode Bookmarks:

• 00:00 - Intro
• 03:37 - Recipe of the Week: Devils on Horseback
• 04:12 - Getting Our Joy Back (Anne Lamott)
• 07:18 - The Symbolism of the Four Horsemen
• 09:03 - The Four Horsemen in the Bible
• 12:38 - How The Four Horsemen Resonate in Literature and Art
• 14:17 - Themes in the World Around Us
• 17:14 - From Ayn Rand, in Atlas Shrugged
• 19:25 - Outro

Resources Mentioned in This Episode (Links on Website):

• Recipe: Devils on Horseback
• Books: The Road by Cormac McCarthy, Option B by Sheryl Sandberg & Adam Grant
• Community Tools: The Conversation Project

#EveryoneDies #FourHorsemen #DeathEducation #EndOfLife #MortalityAwareness #GriefSupport #MeaningInLife #ApocalypseSymbolism #SeriousIllness #Humanities 

Transcript

Hello and welcome to Everyone Dies. Relax and settle in for our podcast about serious illness, dying, death, and bereavement. Because even though everyone dies, no one must face it unprepared.

This week, we have our second show in our humanity series with a discussion about demonic death. You've heard about the four horsemen, war, conquest, famine, death. They're often described as signs of the end of the world, something distant, something coming someday.

But what if they were never meant to be distant? What if they were meant to help us understand the world we're living in? Because when you look closely, these aren't just ancient symbols, they're reflections of real experience, conflict, scarcity, illness, and loss. And once you see them that way, the question shifts. It's no longer, when will they come? It becomes, how do we live in a world where they already exist? I'm Marianne Matzo, a nurse practitioner, and I use my experience from working as a nurse to answer your questions about what happens at the end of life.

And I'm Charlie Navarrette, an actor in New York City, and here to offer an every person viewpoint to our podcast. We're both here because we believe that the more you know, the better prepared you are to make difficult decisions. Remember, this podcast does not provide medical or legal advice.

Please listen to the complete disclosure at the end of the recording. In the first half, Charlie has thoughts about darkness, joy, and evil from Anne Lamont and our recipe of the week. In the second half, I'm going to talk about demonic death.

And in the third half, Charlie has an excerpt from Atlas Shrugged by Anne Rand. How are you doing, Charles? Well, you know, I'm fine. I laugh, I cry.

Actually, no, that's not true. I mostly laugh. Okay, thank you for asking.

What was your question? Oh, Millie is joining us in the studio again this week. I think she's auditioning for the role of Everyone Dies mascot. So, if you hear tinkling, it is not the angels coming for you, it is Millie walking around.

And it's not somebody going to the bathroom. Just so I throw that in just in case, you know. Not that kind of tinkling.

No, not that kind of tinkling. Okay, very good. How's everything with you? How's Oklahoma? Where the wind comes whistling down the plain.

Yeah, yeah, the wind is quite impressive, Charles. It really is. Yes, it is.

You know, like we get a storm and then I have to spend the next day picking up all of my wind chimes and stuff that blew everywhere. So, when you plant, if it's something you recently planted and the wind and rain is exceptionally strong, will the nice little new plant be torn out of its roots? Well, if it is, it becomes an issue of survival of the fittest. It means they weren't meant to survive.

So, you know, we take no prisoners. It's like if it gets blown to the four quarters of the universe, then so be it. Well, this is a show about death.

So, yes, got it. So, survival of the fittest, if you will. Okay, for our first half, our recipe this week is for Devils on Horseback, which involves dates, smoked almonds, and bacon.

I love bacon. Me too. They are a wonderful balance between salty and sweet with a combination of crispy, chewy, and crunchy textures.

My family destroys a tray of these in 15 minutes, which is a great advertisement for taking these bad boys to your next funeral lunch and spreading a little joy at a difficult time. And speaking of joy, I have a piece written by novelist Anne Lamott about getting our joy back. A great warhorse comes upon a sparrow lying in the street on its back, with its legs sticking straight up in the air.

The horse bends down, sneering, and asks, what on earth are you doing? The sparrow replies, I'm trying to hold back the darkness. The horse laughs contemptuously and says, good luck with that. What do you weigh about an ounce? The sparrow says, one does what one can.

In the face of darkness and evil, what can one do to hold back the darkness? We can shine a little brighter. Lighthouses do not run all over the island looking for boats to save. They just stand there, giving off light.

In the face of evil, some days are just too long and all one can do is to try and keep comfortable. Hot tea, warm baths, gentle walks, binging on TV series. This is exactly what Jesus or Buddha would recommend.

Rest as a spiritual act, noticing when too much sand has leaked out of our soul's burlap sacks and intentionally filling back up. How do we shine a little brighter? Gratitude is brightening. Gratitude for all that remains, no matter how much the locusts have eaten, is a subversive act.

Gertrude Stein said that silent gratitude isn't very much to anyone. You want to get happier today? I'll tell you the paradoxical secret. Radical self-love and helping to take care of the poor and suffering.

There are many kinds of hunger and emptiness. Take a sack of healthy, delicious food over to the food pantry. Call your weird anti-vax uncle Ed, who is lonely, ignorant, and family.

Stay on the phone. Say uh-huh a lot. Not running away changes lives, ours and theirs.

One does what one can. Please go to our webpage for this week's recipe of Devils on Horseback and additional resources for this program. This is the part where we ask for your financial support.

Your tax-deductible gift will go directly to supporting our non-profit journalism so that we can remain accessible to everyone. You can donate at www.everyonedies.org that's every the number one dies.org or at our site on Patreon under Everyone Dies. Marianne? Thanks Charlie.

Quote, should the first four of the seven seals of revelation be broken, from the horizon shall come four beings riding on a green, red, black, and pale horse. They shall bring with them many plagues, conflict, hunger, and death, as they are the harbingers of earth's last judgment. End quote.

The four horsemen originate in the book of Revelation authored by John of Patmos. There's some theories that that was John the Baptist, but it's never really been proved. And this was written around the late first century.

This biblical text describes a vision of the end times, presenting the horsemen as omens of calamity. Each horseman represents a significant event or theme, serving as symbolic figures rather than literal beings. These symbols serve as reflections of human experience and ongoing societal themes, offering insight into the challenges faced throughout history and in modern life.

The imagery of the horsemen has deep roots in Jewish apocalyptic literature where conflict, famine, and death dominate. Their presence signifies divine judgment in the struggles humanity faces. Historical interpretations often link each horseman to specific events, such as conquest to imperial expansion, war to conflicts like world wars, famine to agricultural crises, and death to pandemics.

The four horsemen of the apocalypse are mentioned in the Bible in chapter 6 of the book of Revelation, which predicts that they will ride during the apocalypse. The four horsemen are traditionally named war, famine, pestilence, and death. However, the Bible only actually names one death who is the oldest of the riders.

The four horsemen appear when the Lamb Jesus opens the first four seals of a scroll with seven seals, and all of this is described in Revelation chapter 6. As each of the four seals are opened, a different colored horse and rider is seen. When the first seal is opened, a white horse appears. I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals.

Then I heard one of the four living creatures saying a voice like thunder, Come. I looked, and there before me was a white horse. Its rider had a bow, and he was given a crown, and he rode out as a conqueror bent on conquest.

Opinions differ on whether the first horseman riding the white horse represents Christ or a false prophet. The white color of the first horse could mean victory because generals of that time often rode white horses after they had won a battle or war. When the second seal is opened, a red horse appears.

When the Lamb opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, Come. Then another horse came out, a fiery red one. Its rider was given power to take the peace from the earth and to make men slay each other.

To him was given a large sword. The red color of the second horse could mean bloody war, and the sword held by the rider symbolizes war and violence. Then the third seal is opened, and a black horse appears.

When the Lamb opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, Come. I looked, and there before me was a black horse. Its rider was holding a pair of scales in its hand.

When I heard what sounded like a voice among the four living creatures saying, A quart of wheat for a day's wages, and three quarts of barley for a day's wages, and do not damage the oil and the wine. The black color of the third horse could be a symbol of death and famine. Its rider was holding a scale which means scarcity of food, higher prices, and famine.

The fourth seal is opened, and a pale horse appears. Its rider is called Death. When the Lamb opened the fourth seal, I heard a voice in the fourth living creature say, Come.

I looked, and there before me was a pale horse. Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given the power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine, and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

The pale greenish color of the fourth horse means fear, sickness, decay, and death. Death rides a pale horse and signifies the end of life and the fate shared by all. It serves as a reminder of mortality and the inevitability of death.

Across cultures, this horseman resonates in literature and art, often depicted as a universal truth. The presence of death highlights the importance of living meaningfully among uncertainty. The four horsemen inspire countless authors and artists.

Writers often use them as models to convey themes of struggle, despair, and survival. For instance, in literature, novels like The Road by Cormac McCarthy draw parallels between the horseman and the decay of civilization. Artists often depict them in paintings and sculpture, illustrating human fears and societal breakdowns.

These creative expressions resonate deeply, reminding audiences of their relevance across time, insightful reflections on current issues. You can see the first horseman, Conquest, mirror it in debates on political power and imperialism. The second horseman, War, resonates among discussions on conflict in various regions, including ongoing crises in Ukraine and the Middle East.

The third horseman, Famine, highlights food insecurity and economic inequality, issues that affect millions worldwide. Lastly, the fourth horseman, Death, serves as a reminder of health crises, such as the COVID-19 pandemic. Through these connections, the horsemen symbolize universal human experiences, serving as stimuli for discussion and reflection on societal fears and challenges.

Each horseman symbolizes powerful themes that reflect the struggles and challenges you may encounter in the world around you. From the search for power to the harsh realities of war and famine, these horsemen remind us of the difficulties of human existence. They encourage us to reflect on the cycles of life and the lessons of history.

By understanding their significance, we can better appreciate the ongoing conversations about fear, hope, and resilience in our own journey. The horsemen aren't some distant threats. They're a powerful symbol of the spiritual and societal battles we face every day.

Understanding that can make all the difference in navigating through tough times with faith, strength, and hope. Charlie, any questions or thoughts? Yeah, actually, when you mentioned that there are seven seals, and it just never struck me. There's a film by the Swedish director, Ingmar Bergman, and it's called The Seventh Seal.

I never associated that with everything you've just been saying about... Well, and also the movie poster for that film is Death leading a group of souls. Oh, yes, yeah. So that goes back to last week's show when we were talking about the dance of death.

So that's what their movie poster is about. Right, yeah. Yeah, I just never connected that.

And then also when you had mentioned about a pale horse, the Clint Eastwood movie, Pale Rider. Well, I'm glad that all of that symbolism kind of is coming together. I can remember teaching this content and a student saying, oh, I saw something about that on South Park.

And what he was describing was how they take historical things or whatever and do their own thing. And so it's like, oh, I'm glad we could show some of that South Park for you. Yes, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.

As long as the kids learn, it's okay. Oh, dear. In our third half from Ayn Rand in Atlas Shrugged.

The man who refuses to judge, who neither agrees nor disagrees, who declares that there are no absolutes and believes that he escapes responsibility, is the man responsible for all the blood that is now spilled in the world. Reality is an absolute. Existence is an absolute.

A speck of dust is an absolute. And so is a human life. Whether you live or die is an absolute.

Whether you have a piece of bread or not is an absolute. Whether you eat your bread or see it vanish into a looter's stomach is an absolute. There are two sides to every issue.

One side is right and the other is wrong. But the middle is always evil. The man who is wrong still retains some respect for truth, if only by accepting the responsibility of choice.

But the man in the middle is a knave who blanks out the truth in order to pretend that no choice or value exists, who is willing to sit out the course of any battle, willing to cash in on the blood of the innocent or to crawl on his belly to the guilty, who dispenses justice by condemning both the robber and the robbed to jail, who solves conflicts by ordering the thinker and the fool to meet each other halfway. In any compromise between food and poison, it is only death that can win. In any compromise between good and evil, it is only evil that can profit.

In that transfusion of blood which drains the good to feed the evil, the compromise is the transmitting rubber tube. Whoa! You go Charlie! That's it for this week's episode of Everyone Dies. Please stay tuned and thank you for listening.

You can find more episodes on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or your favorite podcast app. Follow and subscribe to the show. This is Charlie Navarrete, and from the last words of baseball great Joe DiMaggio, I'll finally get to see Marilyn.

And I'm Marianne Matzo, and we'll see you next week. Remember, every day is a gift. This podcast does not provide medical advice.

All discussion on this podcast, such as treatments, dosages, outcomes, charts, patient profiles, advice, messages, and any other discussion are for informational purposes only, and are not a substitute for professional medical advice or treatment. Always seek the advice of your primary care practitioner or other qualified health providers with any questions that you may have regarding your health. Never disregard professional medical advice or delay in seeking it because of something you have heard from this podcast.

If you think you may have a emergency, call your doctor or 911 immediately. Everyone Dies does not recommend or endorse any specific tests, practitioners, products, procedures, opinions, or other information that may be mentioned in this podcast. Reliance on any information provided in this podcast by persons appearing on this podcast at the invitation of Everyone Dies, or by other members is solely at your own risk.